It’s been used this way since the 14th century - it has definitely happened! Much later (hundreds of years) a bunch of people got their knickers in a twist about it, and more recently its use has been reinforced to eliminate male-centric language and very recently by the need for gender neutral pronouns.
Once again, I am not objecting to singular “they” for people who are neither male nor female, just for people for whom “he” or “she” is more correct. In the mind of the MC - who identifies the other person as a woman and later calls her “her” - “they” is an OK pronoun, just not the correct one for this situation. It’s the same mistake as calling her “he”.
Like, I’m really not arguing for the point you guys are arguing against here.
This has nothing to do about pronoun/gender assumptions. Singular they is valid to use regardless of pronoun. It’s much much older than singular “you”
Uh…guys, why the hell are we talking about this stuff in a place for fetish games?
On the contrary, I don’t think this has anything to do with singular “they”. You’re preaching to the choir on that. I know full well that “they” has a history as a singular, genderless pronoun. Rather, what I’m seeing as a problem is that the main character sees someone and thinks “That’s a woman with her hands on her hips,” but then, in the very next sentence, she switches to referring to the woman as “them”. Why? It doesn’t make sense.
Calling it a “grammatical error” was probably confusing. I would have just called it an inconsistency. But regardless, I do think it should be changed.
Because the word “grammar” was used and people got sidetracked into thinking this was a discussion about the validity of singular “they”. It’s not about that.
well… yeah but where are the fatties? we need more wg stages that’s all XD
Hm, alright, since the singular “they” is being brought up into an argument regarding grammar. I have to a question to ask then. Since you do not object to the use of the singular “they”, then how exactly is it inconsistent? The singular they is gender neutral, as in, it can imply either male, or female, or neither. With this in mind, it is disingenuous to suggest that it would be inconsistent regarding grammar.
This is because it is quite literally, as you two suggested, gender neutral. To suggest that said neutrality is it’s own category of pronouns unlike the gendered pronouns is just not even respecting the neutrality of the term. So no, if you are truly respecting the singular they, you would realize that it can be used interchangeably with gendered terms. This is because, the person is still a person, regardless of gender. Whether you know them or not.
This is like arguing and saying that a hamburger is not a sandwich. It’s still a sandwich, and it’s still factually correct to call it a sandwich, to suggest otherwise because it’s more specifically a hamburger is just silly. This is just arguing semantics at this point. So no, I would have to objectively disagree with the notion that this is bad grammar, rather just playing semantics on a fetish game.
Additionally, before you try to prove me wrong, and try to deflect my points by saying it is somehow different or inconsistent, I hope you realize that argument is essentially saying that men and women are not people. Which is just ridiculous.
If you’re going to try to prove me wrong, then perhaps you could do me the courtesy of addressing my actual position? I have stated multiple times now that I do not consider this a grammar issue (although perhaps the person who originally brought this up does), and I’m starting to get tired of being lectured over a stance that I never took.
This is the inconsistency that I see:
You see a small woman with her hands on her hips, looking quite cross at you. You don’t recognise them.
Referring to the woman as “them” is fine. Referring to the woman as “her” is also fine. But using both those pronouns in quick succession just sounds weird. The MC has never hesitated to refer to women and girls that she meets using the pronouns “she” or “her”. Why is she suddenly being more cautious now? And more importantly, why is she backpedaling just one sentence later? It’s inconsistent behavior, not grammar.
This is like arguing and saying that a hamburger is not a sandwich.
No, this is more like spending your whole life calling a hamburger a hamburger and nothing else, and then one day, out of the blue, calling it a sandwich for no particular reason. Can you do that and still be correct? Sure. But why would you do that?
Then you’re just moving the goalpost about your position. There is no “inconsistency” in the language, if you know that they’re used interchangeably. If you acknowledge that a burger is a sandwich, then calling a burger a sandwich already has its reasons. Your confusion is just semantics, again. It’s like constantly calling a male a guy, then reverting to calling them male a few times. The terminology is applicable, there is no contradiction in the language, because such attributes are still represented. Having diversity in terminology, doesn’t make descriptions “inconsistent”.
They’re not used interchangeably. The pronouns “her” and “them” may have some overlap in the cases where they are used, but they are not similar enough to be swapped for each other at random. If I’m asked to refer to someone as “she”, I’m not going to randomly refer to that person as “they” every now and then just because it happens to be technically correct. If you know a person’s gender, you acknowledge it–consistently. It’s not even something that people have to make a conscious effort to do–they just do use the same set of pronouns every time when referring to people they know.
Good writing is not just a matter of using words that are technically correct. You’re trying to make it sound natural, and consistent with the character who is speaking. I do not consider randomly switching between “her” and “them” when referring to the same person to be either natural-sounding or consistent with the MC’s other interactions.
You’re making a very specific situation that doesn’t always happen. Not only that, but you’re setting a realistic expectation for a fetish game.
If you’re arguing about the importance of flow in writing, then that’s rather more subjective, rather than objective, since it depends on what the person is writing. Not all writings are about flow, rather they can be about information, and various other things that could probably put a damper on flow. We’re talking about a game which involves a lot of measurements like weight, and is very description based. Of course they’re going to go for more information based descriptions instead of flow. Advocating for a game that is about pretty unrealistic measurements for an appetizer to have more natural dialogue kind of just sounds silly on paper. Not only that, but kind of just makes the game more difficult to make now that I think about it. If the game had more natural dialogue, it’s just going to be harder to write, given such a more strict word choice. Having a larger arsenal of word choices makes it easier to convey the same meaning anyway, which is what matters the most.
When you talk to someone, it’s about understanding them, which is more aligned to information rather than flow and consistency realistically. It’s actually a key part of story telling, because a person may not always have all the information, yet may be able to convey it in a way that might be slightly foreign to you. Granted, it may not be a natural way of speaking, but at least the point gets across. Given that, what’s the point of arguing for consistency in that regard? It’s why metaphors, and various other literary aspects exist. Since our language is more about fluidity rather than consistency and structure to convey meaning.
Alright I’m going to stop this discussion here. The original point was stated here and the dev is now aware of it. Regardless of how correct or not the suggestion is, it’s up to the dev to decide if a change is needed or not. This conversation has long devolved into circular arguments that only serve to further derail this topic. Any further discussion on this manner will be treated as off topic and removed.
Understood, my apologies.
Been playing this game but cant seem to get the save feature to work, is it working atm?
the only way to save the game is by getting ready to work, you clic “save game” and instantly a .json file will be downloaded to your computer, then when you start a new game by closing the tab you clic were it says load from the device or something like that and then you select the .json file and that’s it
Ah right of course. I did some playing round with settings and discovered that my adblocker was stopping the download for some reason.
that explains a lot XD i’m the same user btw just in another device (i forgot my old password lol)
can’t wait to see what you have install for us in 6.0 dude, i hope everything is going ok with you even if your busy right now and it takes much longer than planned
Thanks for comment, I am doing well. Progress on the update has been slow but consistent, I would wager that I am between 80-90% done. This update has turned out to be the biggest one by a large margin thanks to a couple of factors. Semi spoilers ahead:
- I wanted to implement a couple new NPC’s that serve to help flesh out the world. As a result exploring areas now will include a lot more things to run into.
- One of those new NPC’s has a full fleshed out storyline that also is split into 2 paths.
- I reworked the layout of the workday so that it flows better and makes it more likely you run into coworkers, and change it so that overtime is now something that is tracked on its own and will happen independent of the rest of the workday. I also added some new events for you to come across. Your coworkers also have more going on with them, they even get names this time around.
- Each of the main romance options have elements that are unique to them, so this meant creating unique storylines as well as game play elements. Currently Jamie and Stephanie have been completed with Beth’s section nearing completion.
The following is what is left to be done before the next update comes out:
Finish Beth’s unique storyline
Wrap up Lilly Questline
Implement a few more lab scenes
Compared to what has already been completed this list is relatively short so like I said, hopefully it won’t be much longer. I already have a few people helping with Beta testing at this point so once I have finished it shouldn’t take long to get it out into the public.
All this sounds rad. Thanks for the teaser.