is there a metric option?
Translations of that game revealed that at least one character depicted in fetish content within was a minor. Consequentially, all links to the game were removed from the site.
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oh that explains it
was wondering why
what is this game about? what do u do in this game?
Well i have had some time to work on the game during some time off with the holidays and have gotten the game back to a launching state, its still unplayable due to needing to completely overhaul the turn control/flow to accommodate the new npcs. However, now that it launches and i can start testing different new features which there are plenty of, I have found a new possible issue. With 10,000 npcs it takes a few seconds to compute all of their decisions meaning the game hangs while working on them. This has multiple possible solutions:
- waiting for all the npcs is ok(take no action for now)
- reduce the number of npcs to lessen the waiting time
- allow the player to decide the number of npcs at the start of game
- find help to figure out how to implement multiprocessing into the game to allow parallel turn taking for the npcs(if you have good knowledge and of python and renpy i most defiantly could use some advice, pointers, help here)
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The last option may not be doable at all. I know multithreading in python is a bad idea because of the global interpreter lock. Multiprocessing may be possible but, we have a renpy interpreter parsing the renpy script on top of the python one, so i have no clue how that plays into it, and i have no experience with multiprocessing in python, considering i’m teaching myself python as i go here.
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The game was definitely fun, but around when my character got 250, they lost all greed and barely ate everything. Now I’m trying to find the few friends that support heavier lifestyles and invite them to parties. Should I try and reach the target goal my character wants or should I just keep trying to find the right people?
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Well you can achieve what you want multiple ways, there are multiple mechanics at play here. You don’t need to necessarily slim down to the target weight. Doing so can achieve multiple things, lessening or completely removing the unhappiness gained from being over the target weight. Dipping under it would make your character eat more also having the effect of increasing greed on their own by making them over eat. Also playing into your target weight is your characters knowledge of their weight measurements and looks. If you know something they know that also, same with things you don’t know. They can’t be unhappy with their weight if they don’t know it. The flip side is refusing to use the scale clearly puts them in denial of changes they perceive to be happening. You clearly already have a grasp how interacting with others effects, it. Have fun playing with and combining these mechanics in different ways to achieve your goals.
New question, which for me has been put on my back burner as i have built other parts of the game which is how to implement a calendar for use in the game, that does not break immersion to much. I really don’t wanna deal with the irregularity of a real life calendar, but would if its necessary. For the purposes of the game having 12 months with the same number of days greatly simplifies things.
What type of calendar should the game use
- A fake 12 month calendar with each month having 30 days
- A real calendar like in real life(most work)
- Something else
0 voters
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This game is definitely a bit more intricate than I first thought, I can see why it has garnered quite a bit of popularity on this site
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Working on the npcs today, and am having mixed thoughts on if how to determine if a npc should become either a feedee or feeder. Lots of different questions like; Should they and your character be allowed to become both? Do some of the npcs start with either or both? How would you know by tracking various stats if a npc is eligible to become one or the other? Is it tracking number of accepted snacks? Or how much weight they have gained while liking it? Im looking for thoughs and suggestions on some sort of system. Fyi the old system is they either spwaned with it or did not, and was rather crude and uninvolved.
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I think it would be more fun to allow the player and the npcs be both feeders and feedees, would lead to more fats after all. I also think that it’d make more sense for it to be based on amount of weight gained while liking it, but it being based on accepted snacks could also work. Maybe if npcs encourage you to gain weight for long enough (while you’re gaining weight in that period of time) they’ll become feeders? Just an idea I had.
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For both NPCs and the player, I like the idea of the possibility of being both but that any character can still only be one or the other.
For the player i think this could be relativly easy; just like sometimes you can say if someone larger than you looks hot or not, you could have a similar thing of when you feed someone “did you like that, yes or no”. Litterally asking the player what kind of content they want to see more of.
For NPCs its harder, because if it’s a random roll or variable increase each time a certain event (such as accepting snacks or gaining weight and liking it) happens eventually all feeders will also be feedees. I feel like the player again could have some influence here, just like NPCs can engourage the player to gain weight, the player encouraging the NPCs to gain could lean the NPC towards being a feedee. Ideally there would also be some sort of background system that can make NPCs feedees/feeders on their own so that they don’t all come from the player, but i’m not sure what that would look like.
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I’m fairly certain you can’t multithread directly in Python (CCP Games, the makers of EVE Online, have discussed this at length since EVE’s core is or was in Stackless Python); you have to port out to a different language (eg C++) and then return to the Python code, and I have no clue how Renpy would react to such a thing. So the game either asking for user input on number of NPCs, or performing some sort of in-house benchmark of the system to determine an optimal number would probably be your best option. That being said, 10,000 is an obscene number of NPCs to begin with; I forget the source, but statistically I believe most people have fewer than 500 people they interact with “routinely”, and this number is influenced heavily by one’s job, socioeconomic status, and lifestyle. (For example because I work in retail I probably push the edge of this number, where if I worked in an office setting and do most of my shopping online I might be lucky to see 50 people often enough to be considered “routine” interaction.)
For the next topic, feederism status… should be something easy to influence on the PC. Like how we can influence “goal weight” by indicating that increasing numbers on the scale or outgrowing clothing is “hot”, routinely choosing to feed others at parties should trigger growth in the “Feeder” direction, possibly accelerated/enhanced by our feeding targets being feedees/curious. (Example of stages being like, “They push you away.” “They take the cupcake, but eat it on their own.” “They’re uncertain, but accept it because you’re a friend.” “They happily eat the cupcake out of your hand.” “They devour the cupcake greedily.” “They devour the cupcake and ask for more.”) NPC Feeders could grow as simply as offering you their leftovers at lunch, or pizza when they get takeout, or bringing in donuts for public consumption. As their feederism grows with your repeated acceptance, they begin to get pushy, insisting that you have their leftovers, some pizza, a donut or so. Obviously there would have to be a cap to how pushy they got in professional settings, but at parties…
P.S. It’s good to see you back, I was worried about the inactivity - that I/we had put you off continuing with this…
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Been doing some testing with different numbers of npcs to experiment with amount of memory needed to support different counts. Your guys response to this will help me set numbers that most peoples devices can handle.
How much RAM does the device you play on have?
- 1gb or less
- 2gb
- 4gb
- 6gb
- 8gb or more(Ren’Py so far in my experience can’t really scale this high no point in going higher.)
0 voters
Ok, so preliminary testing puts 4000 npcs at around 3.3gb of ram usage just to start the game, i expect this number to double by the time your 1000 days in. Also i don’t know how renpy’s rollback function is going to play into how much it will expand. The reason im sharing this is, first like some of you have pointed out 10,000 npcs is fairly high for an npc count, however even though 500 seems like a large amount, it does not allow for diversity as you progress. 500 starts to get to the point where the simulation of the city and people allows for great enough diversity, in version 1.4. The real problem with smaller npc counts, is you have issues with the number of fellow feeders and feedees. Unless, everyone starts becoming a feedee or feeder at which point were exiting realism.
So, I guess this gets in to some of the other changes and additions to the game that i have been working on while completely going through the entire game to allow for the npcs to do everything the player does(including all events you see). The city has been divided into six what im calling districts. Some only have jobs while others have jobs and housing. Not all jobs or housing can be found in all of the districts. Also you cant get to all the districts with the bus and walk travel options, further segmenting the city. In order for each district to really start to feel like its own ecosystem there really needs to be at least 300npcs in each one meaning you need 1800 npcs(~1.2gb starting memory) to fill all 6. I’d really like to see 500 per district but then were up to 3000 total npcs(~2gb starting memory).
What’s the point of sharing all of this? Well obviously first off, i have created a ram consuming monster. I am currently considering multiple ways to tone back the simulation to reign in the amount of objects in memory, the main culprit being the humans, ie the player and the npcs. The bigger thing is i realized to balance the economy i can’t just let the player pick the number of npcs because i have to have the correct corresponding amounts of housing and jobs, in each district which gets tricky to do if its all variable at the start depending on what the player picks. So i have decided that im going to set a number and that will be it, allowing me to hard code what’s there.
So wrapping this up im targeting the game to use 3-6gb of ram. Few things this does, first it most defiantly kills me ever releasing a html build, also kills building this for ios and andriod. While those were never high on my list of things to make work going down the advanced npc route has sort of closed off those options.
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How long is it supposed to take to earn your degree? I feel like I’ve been going to the classes for it for a long time but haven’t gotten it yet. A useful feature for a future update could be to implement a count of how many classes needed for a degree, similar to the experience needed counter already in game.
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For version 1.4.2 250 classes for the degrees and 50 classes for the certificates. A counter of sorts is on the to do list, has been for a while but i have had plans of changing how the school system works so the plan has always been to add it after the change so i don’t have to rework it later.
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::eyes 32GB memory kit sitting in corner of room::
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Another little thing I’d really like to see in the next release build (I’ve mentioned this before but I’ve just started a new run so I’m reiterating) - absolute control over the PC’s behavior. None of this “You decide to do x (in contradiction to the daily plan)” stuff. At most, the PC should express their opinion of your choice if it differs from what they want. (eg “You’d rather an ‘active’ exercise routine today.” or “You’d much prefer a hearty diet today.” or “You resent being made to walk when you’re so overweight.” as a few possible levels of expressed discontent.) And take hits to happiness accordingly.
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Ok so this is back to the shared control of the ai, and should it get removed:
Short answer is no. (all of you who have followed this thread and don’t wanna see my rant should stop here)
Slightly longer answer is go read quite a few of my previous posts on why not. (if you haven’t followed and cant take no for an answer then i guess go read the rest of the thread)
Responding this specific request for change: (to my rant about this specific suggestion)
This would really not work for various reasons:
Starting with the happiness hit for each option, would have to be variable to even start matching the variability of the ai decision making depending upon situation. Unless i showed you the unhappiness hit of a decision before you make it this would be extremely frustrating for the player. I’m not open to showing that before hand, because it encourages min maxing of stats during play, which i dislike and am trying reduce the ability for players to do. I personally think games that encourage people to make stat tables for items in game along with showing all character stats, such that people can make optimal builds, extremely tedious boring and just suck the life out of the game. Generally i find this is because the difficulty of playing the game is just then replaced with the tedium of making an optimal character to crush what ever task it was built to do. Were are no longer playing a game and just solving math problems, using stat tables, at this point.
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It would end with at the max unhappiness setting of it really trying to discourage certain actions, it would be called game breaking, and i would get comments wondering why i even offer the option in the first place, or to remove the system all together, all of which i have already discussed and went through. Again see earlier posts.
The system gives you a choice, however just like in real life, your choices don’t always lead to the outcome you planed was going to happen, for various reasons. People chose to go on diets all the time, sometimes they succeed in following through on that choice and eat the proper amounts, other times they fail to follow through(for various reasons) and have that ''cheat day", or several in a row. Same the other way, example lets look at the story of another game Forks, the main character Alex had chose to start “caketime”, multiple times in the past, but has failed to follow through. When she made that choice i’d be fairly sure she didn’t plan to not follow through, it just happened.
The game gives you a choice, that’s different from guaranteeing an outcome. I really need you all to understand choice being different from a guaranteed outcome.
Edit: So when looking at a choice outcome branch tree, there is simple ones like 1 choice leads to 1 outcome. For example picking sandwich means you always get a sandwich. Or you could add a variable into the mix for instance having a variable for the type of sandwich meaning the choice of sandwich could lead to lets say 6 different sandwiches. Now lets get way more complex and look at my game where you have a character with 150 plus tracked objects(some form of variable) for the character. some of these objects are complex like lists and dictionaries of other objects, that can have multiple values. When looking at a choice outcome branch tree if you assume more than one variable here is influencing the outcome of that 1 choice you made can lead to an array of outcomes, variable dependent. The problem and complaint i continue to get, is that there are outcomes that you all desire and expect and ones you don’t desire or expect. What it seems is wanted is a 1 to 1 equivalence for each choice to an outcome(when this happens you ''feel in control" choices led to an expected outcome). With suggestions on how to balance doing this by suggesting systems like the one suggested to balance the fact that were ignoring a bunch of the correct or more reasonable outcomes given the objects(variables) at play, by adding a penalty in trade for ignoring it them. So what’s the point of pointing this all out or discussing it. My point is this is a simulation of what would or could happen in the game. I don’t intend the player to be able to just skip bad or undesirable outcomes for a trade at the time of choice, for pre determined penalty. You are free to make a choice, however the outcome is what it is, desirable or not.
I really hope to not revisit the topic of shared control with the ai again. This design choice of this game with the shared control with the ai, as i thought i made i clear earlier, its not getting removed and is here to stay. As i said in the past, i’m open to hearing feedback as to the balance of the ai and if its making reasonable decisions, however if you suggest removing it, going forward depending on my mood i may either go on another rant or just ignore you. Either way i can guarantee you i will continue doing exactly as i please, which i have also tried to make clear earlier.
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I apologize for (unintentionally) beating a dead horse. I’m not in the habit of reading through large threads and didn’t know this topic had been brought up in the past. The last thing I want to do is piss you off, because I really enjoy this game (outside of that nuisance mechanic) and I want to see it completed. So I’ll drop the issue and not bring it up again.
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